To bring your vision to reality you have to have passion. At Beyond The Crucible, we say that to bounce back from your worst day, your crucible, to get beyond it and live a life of significance, a life on purpose dedicated to serving others, you have to be off-the-charts passionate about your vision. That is true. Passion is important.
But as you are on the journey to make your life-affirming vision a reality, there will inevitably be setbacks. Passion helps us have perseverance to get beyond those setbacks. There are people we want to help. Our passion is like rocket fuel helping to propel our vision forward.
Unfortunately, it is often the case that that which is good can also have a downside. Left unchecked, we can be so passionate about our vision that we can sometimes unintentionally hurt other people. We are so focused on the task of bringing our vision to reality to help others we can actually hurt the people on our team. We can become short with them, become irritable and impatient. Our team members may offer suggestions to make our vision better or have it happen in a better way, and we just don’t want to listen. If those suggestions might cause delays in the rollout of the vision, even if those delays may indeed make sense and may be prudent, we are too impatient to listen. We are fueled by our passion to move forward, but we can leave a trail of destruction in our wake.
Too much passion can indeed be dangerous. I know this from personal experience. Beneath my often calm and reserved exterior, I am at heart a passionate person. I have strong convictions about many things. I just don’t happen to talk about them all the time. But they are there nonetheless.
My cautionary tale of too much passion was my $2.25B takeover in 1987. I had graduated from Oxford University, spent time on Wall Street and received my MBA from Harvard Business School. My father had died earlier that year, and I felt the company had strayed from the vision of my great great grandfather John Fairfax, who had founded my family’s 150-year-old media business in Australia. I also believed that the company was not being well managed. Fifteen years earlier in 1976, other family members had removed my father as chairman of the company. All this produced a huge amount of passion within me. I felt my father had been wrongfully removed, the company had strayed from the vision of the founder and was not being well managed. As I was coming back from Harvard Business School, I felt something had to be done and done now.
And so in late August 1987, just a few months after graduating, I launched my takeover. Things went wrong from the beginning. Other family members sold out, not wanting to be trapped in a privatized company run by the 26-year-old that I then was. Within the three years the debt was so high that when Australia ran into a recession in 1990, the company had to file for bankruptcy. My actions led to friction within the family and instability within the thousands of employees of the company.
What had gone wrong? How could an Oxford graduate with a Harvard MBA have launched such an unwise takeover? In short, too much passion. It led to hiring the wrong advisers, who told me what I wanted to hear, and ignoring the good advisers. My passion clouded my judgement and caused me to make rash and ill-advised decisions. It was a powerful and very painful lesson. From then on, I have sought to keep my passion in check, or perhaps better put, make sure my passion is channeled correctly and wisely. My passion needs some guardrails.
So how do we have our passion fuel our vision, but not cause destruction?
1. Recognize the danger. Passion is not bad, but it can cause destruction and hurt people. It comes with a warning label, “Handle with care.”
2. Knowledge is power. We use this phrase on Beyond The Crucible often. When we realize that passion can be dangerous, we can begin to understand that we have to be careful as we seek to bring our vison to reality. We can begin to understand how our passion manifests itself and when it does so in an unhealthy way.
3. Be vulnerable. One key step of wisdom is to admit to our team and those that could be affected by our passion, that we sometimes can have a problem. We believe in the vision so much that sometimes we can go over the top and unintentionally cause some damage that could also hurt people and relationships.
4. Ask for help. Having recognized the danger and admitted that you have a problem, ask your team members or those potentially affected by our passion for help. If they see you going over the top with passion, your team members can really help. They can say something like, “I can see you are very passionate about this. Is there something that has come up that has touched a nerve, because I feel your passion is at another level at the moment?”
5. Reflect on why you are so passionate at the moment. Try to calmly understand what is going on within you as this sea of passion is rising up.
6. Pray. I am a person of faith, so when I feel that my passion may be getting a bit out of control I pray. It is something like this, “Lord I feel so passionate about this. But I don’t want my passion getting in the way of this mission. I certainly don’t want to hurt people. Please calm my spirit.” That does not mean I don’t want to have passion, I just want it not to overwhelm me or others.
7. Channel your passion appropriately. Having recognized the danger, been vulnerable, asked for help, reflected on what is going on and prayed, there is another step. Having calmed down a bit, reflect on what strategies you will use to channel your passion appropriately. You may be at the point where you can begin to think rationally. You may also feel someone else on your team may be better positioned to calmly and forcefully advocate for your mission.
In the years since my failed $2.25B takeover, I have tried to channel my passion appropriately. It doesn’t mean that I never have some passion go over the top, like lava coming to the surface, but I feel that my passion serves me better now. When I feel almost too passionate, I now for the most part realize it. I am vulnerable. It could be with my wife, my team or with a number of people in ministries I am involved with. Sometimes I even apologize for having too much passion. That leads to discussions about who is the best person to talk about the issue, which may not be me. I pray as I have mentioned for the Lord to calm my spirit so that my passion does not get in the way of what I or the organizations I am involved with are trying to achieve. With my spirit calmed, I can then begin to think rationally and chart a course to continue bringing my vision to reality. Sometimes what I think is an urgent issue, is not so urgent. Sometimes when I think something must be said, it really does not need to be said.
I still have a lot of passion, but my passion is serving me better. It is fueling the vision I have and is helping it to become reality. But my passion is now serving me, rather than me being beholden to or controlled by my passion. In short, your passion needs to serve your purpose. If it is not, you need to get your passion under control until it does.
Reflection
Is your passion serving your purpose?
If it is not, reflect on what is going on and share with others that you are having difficulty channeling your passion appropriately.
Pray or mediate on what is going on, and ask for your spirit to be calmed so that your passion can indeed serve your purpose.
We share inspirational stories and transformational tools from leaders who have moved beyond life’s most difficult moments to create lives of significance.
Relationships, including with those we call fellow travelers, are critical, we learn in this week’s episode, to crafting the resilience we need to move beyond our crucibles.
Our guest this week, Dr. Marie-Helene Pelletier, is a pioneer in the field of strategic resilience. Her studies and experience have taught her that thriving through setback and failure is not a trait we manifest innately, but a skill we must build. How do we do it?
As you’ll discover in her conversation with Warwick, Dr. Pelletier says the change professionals and leaders need to make is to approach their resilience the same way they approach a successful business using a strategic plan. That’s what creates helpful, sustainable, and reliable long-term resilience.
The key components to that plan, she says, include relationships, knowing what energizes you and what drains you, and leaning into your values as you consider your next action step on your journey back from trials and challenges.
To learn more about Dr. Pelletier, visit www.drmarie-helene.com
To explore Beyond the Crucible resources, including our free Trials-to-Triumphs Self-Assessment, visit beyondthecrucible.com
Enjoy the show? Leave a review on your favorite podcast app and be sure to tell your friends and family about us.
Warwick Fairfax:
Welcome to Beyond the Crucible. I'm Warwick Fairfax, the founder of Beyond the Crucible.
Marie-Helene Pelletier:
Let's say right now you are very surrounded. You've got your own executive coach, you've got your own peer network. You talk to Gary on a regular basis, this is there. So if you're creating a strategic plan to get your resilience to the next level, it doesn't need to be there. It's already part of your life. It's in, you're good. You're going to focus on other things. But if it's not there, it will probably become a pillar to say, oh my God, I've been focusing on other projects and I've let go of investing in relationships even though each of our plans will be different based on our values and all this. The reality is we do have research that indicates the kinds of things that will, we know from research, increase our resilience. Relationships is one of them.
Gary Schneeberger:
Relationships, including with those we call fellow travelers are critical, we learn in this week's episode, to crafting the resilience we need to move beyond our crucibles. Hi, I am Gary Schneeberger, co-host of the show. Our guest this week, Dr. Marie-Helene Pelletier is a pioneer in the field of strategic resilience. Her studies and experience have taught her that thriving through setback and failure is not a trait we manifest innately, but a skill we must build. How do we do it? As you'll discover in her conversation with Warwick, Dr. Pelletier says the change professionals and leaders need to make is to approach their resilience the same way they approach a successful business using a strategic plan. That's what creates helpful, sustainable, and reliable long-term resilience. The key components to that plan, she says, include relationships, knowing what energizes you and what drains you, and leaning into your values as you consider your next action step on your journey back from trial.
Warwick Fairfax:
Thank you Marie-Helene for being here. Just so looking forward to the discussion. Really enjoyed reading your book and so many interesting things in there about having a resilient strategy. Never thought about that before. We will be diving into that, but I know you live in Vancouver in the British Columbia area, but I think from Quebec or I guess as English speakers, but I guess it should be Quebec, so I'll try. But tell us what life was like for you growing up, and obviously you became a psychologist and then got your MBA. Were there clues in your background growing up that you could look back and say, well, it's not a surprise that Marie-Helene would go into psychology as a vacation?
Marie-Helene Pelletier:
Well, and it's an absolute pleasure to be here with both of you. It is a good question. I was looking actually not that long ago to my high school graduation book and what was in there, and one of the things at the time, there's a few pieces that I think we're not saying clearly, this is what I would do, and plus some of that I discovered as I went, really, I had not decided I would do business after psychology. I did psychology, and then I can explain how I got there, but that's where I went. But in terms of earlier years, I was very much interested in anything scientific.
So science in general, which there's tons of, that's what psychology is based on. So there's a lot of that there. Most of what I do right now is public speaking, giving keynotes and that kind of thing. At the time, I spent two and a half years, almost three years in a group that were singing and dancing, so doing lots of shows internationally, the whole thing. I was on a stage basically, so when you become a speaker and at some point people tell you, oh, you're going to get to those audiences where you don't see the audience because the lights are so big and all that. I already knew that. So there was some pieces like this, but the rest, as I said, just came with the, it's where the road took me.
Warwick Fairfax:
So what kind of musical shows did you do?
Marie-Helene Pelletier:
It was, I know. It was a group of, so the group itself was fairly large, about 50 people on stage. We were usually about 30, and it was a group that would sing on mostly songs that were very popular in that moment and do just choreographed dancing with that, which since then, there's been many other groups, way more professional, high level than we were at the time, but because of the time, it actually worked really well. We did the Paris Olympia in there.
Warwick Fairfax:
Wow.
Marie-Helene Pelletier:
Yeah, I know.
Warwick Fairfax:
That's amazing.
Marie-Helene Pelletier:
Who knew?
Warwick Fairfax:
But I'm sure that probably helped later, the whole stage fright thing, which I know you talk about in the book, so that's fascinating. So you made a decision to become a psychologist. There's a lot of areas of science, why psychology? What about psychology just pulled you in and you thought, gosh, this is me. I love psychology.
Marie-Helene Pelletier:
Yeah, I loved, I was amazed and at the time, again, for me, we're talking what, over 25 years ago, so now psychology is very popular. It's a degree that many people consider even as a first thing to do. They do it out of interest, all this. At the time, no, no, no. Everyone who was doing a bachelor degree in psychology was clearly on track to become a psychologist, this is what we were doing. You'd often have to explain almost what we did. Mental health was not a topic that was easily discussed, definitely not in the workplace. So for me, it realizing the amount of research that was available, the amount of change that most of us could experience in such a positive, significant way if we knew about this information, and so that to me was enough to say, okay, yes, need to do this.
Warwick Fairfax:
Interesting. So it almost seems like you went in to understand psychology because it could empower people.
Marie-Helene Pelletier:
Yes.
Warwick Fairfax:
Some people go into it thinking, I want to help and fix people or cure people that might feel broken, and obviously what does that mean? I guess obviously there's scientific terms, but for you it felt like, I want to empower people. People now talk about positive psychology. That probably wasn't a thing 20 years ago, but it's more popular now.
Marie-Helene Pelletier:
That's right. It was just emerging. But even when there is a thing that is challenging that we would like to in some ways fix or change, one of my areas of specialization has been anxiety in different ways because at the time it was clinical psychology and that's what was there. But even then, if you're dealing with, say, panic attacks on a daily or on a weekly basis, learning the tools and being able to apply them is a major life shift and it is empowering even in that context. So yes, it was very much my approach to it for different situations.
Warwick Fairfax:
I think you've written a bit about how you got from psychology to business and decided to get an MBA, which I think if you mentioned there aren't that many folks who have a psychology background and a business background. They seem to be different, but you-
Marie-Helene Pelletier:
Plus, We're done with schooling at some point.
Warwick Fairfax:
Exactly. So what led you to the business side to MBA?
Marie-Helene Pelletier:
I was probably already a bit different from a larger majority of my colleagues here, and then I realized I was also a bit different from my business colleagues, so I'm an in of one no matter where I go. But what happened though is I decided to do my doctoral research about 20 years ago in the area of the time that was called telehealth. So could we, using video conferencing, provide therapy at a distance? Hello, we all do it now, blah, blah, blah. But at the time, we could not even use the internet to do it. It was not fast enough. I had to use six telephone lines to transmit both video and audio data to test whether this was even an option. So it required me doing a lot of relationship building. I had to have supervisors from Hawaii because, and there was an Army medical center dispatched there that would use telehealth a lot with US Army on ships.
I had to find people like this to contribute to my overall research. I also had to get a lot of people to either fund the research, find people to even work in a volunteer way with me. And so it ended up being a lot of management of money, of networking, of organizing of all this, and then I finished and I went to my PhD supervisor. I said, I'm going to need a recommendation letter. She said, fantastic postdoc. And I said, no, we're doing an MBA. That's how I realized that's at that moment, I knew this is what I was interested in doing next. So that's how it happened.
Warwick Fairfax:
It seems like you always wanted to empower people. And then so the whole management organizational challenges with telehealth, did it feel like I want to use my psychological training in the business world to empower people, empower systems, individuals, high performers? Do you feel like your vision sort of found you, if you will?
Marie-Helene Pelletier:
Oh, yes, very much so. It was a combination of taking risks, trying different things, seeing what's connecting with my values, what's important for me, and then seeing what's there and taking opportunities. And yes, at times knowing that it may or may not work, but we're trying this.
Warwick Fairfax:
When did you decide that your life's work would revolve around residents?
Marie-Helene Pelletier:
It happens because as I started doing more roles in leadership, senior leadership roles, that kind of thing, in the various organizations I was in, inevitably there would be at times people who would say, okay, we need to talk to one of your executive coaches or psychologist, and we want one of your most senior people kind of thing. So that ended up being with me. Then I ended up working a lot with professionals and leaders who were fabulous at so many things they do, and at some point needing something to give them an edge.
And I realized, oh, that is that proactive resilience. And many times, especially in the recent years, they were of course very aware of all the things we should do to increase our resilience they did not have time to make any of this happen. And then I realized it is in part because they're not being strategic about it, and it's through giving examples, helping them see it that way, seeing how it clicked and completely made sense to them that I thought, okay, and then, well, the other thing that happened is a number of them would at some point say, this is so helpful.
I'm so glad I have this now. I wish I had it sooner. And then I heard this a few times and eventually I clicked. I said, if I write it, someone's going to get it sooner. That will be one good thing. And yeah, that's what led to the book.
Warwick Fairfax:
Oh, that's interesting. So there's a story which we'll get to in a second of you with your husband, Nick in the Canadian Rockies, but before we get there, it seems like it's sort of a backdrop to that. One of the things you write about, there's a lot of high-performing leaders that tend to feel like I got here because I can get through anything. I'm like, Superman, Superwoman, I can get, I'm bulletproof. It's just like, give me a challenge and I laugh at the challenge and here we go, never met a challenge I can't overcome.
Then eventually you do find a challenge that's like, it's not a speed bump. It's like Mount Everest, and even high performing leaders when they hit Mount Everest, it's like, huh. I've never experienced this challenge in my life. I've got challenges at home, challenges at work. It seems like there is a trap for almost high performing leaders to a degree of setup to fail, because they've been so successful. It's like, resilience? That's for the other guy, that's for lesser mortals than me being this heroic successful figure. Did you sort of find that you had almost people with delusions of, I don't need resilience because I'm superhuman kind of thing?
Marie-Helene Pelletier:
Yes, yes. And that's interesting because even these leaders, and in many of these that includes me, we will actually tell others. That includes me. That could happen to me as well. You say the things because logically, of course, yeah, no, but deep down you're thinking not really. And now, it's in part what happens is, it's not just your fault. Yes, The reality is you've gone through a number of challenges and not everyone has, and you did and it worked, and so okay, there's a logic there. And then the other piece that happens too is people around you start telling you, you are the rock. You can do this, you can do anything. You're the rock of the family, the rock of the team.
You're like, yes, like I said earlier, we can throw anything at you, and it's obviously said in a very positive, highly valued way. So you take it and then there may be a little voice in the back of your head that says, well, careful, actually, you're human like everybody else, but no, no, no, you don't listen to this. You just carry on. And so it does become a trap. The solution to that trap, it's not complicated. It doesn't take any of your strengths or your abilities or none of this, but being realistic about it and being realistic about the fact that yes, we do need to nourish it is what changes everything.
Warwick Fairfax:
Absolutely. And we'll get into this in a moment, just being proactive before the hurricane hits, so to speak. When the hurricane hits, it's not the time to say, let's plan on what to do. It's a bit late at that point. So talk about, it's almost like a parable, if you will, a real life parable of when you're on this eight day trek in the Canadian Rockies with your husband, and just talk about, there's a radical difference between day one and day eight that, again, is really, you weren't trying to exemplify your life's work. You weren't trying to be your life's work. Obviously that wasn't the goal, and you probably already had written some of these thoughts. I don't know if the book was published back then, but it's not like you had no thoughts about resilience or no understanding, I'm guessing, by the time you went on this trek. Just talk about that trip and why that is really a parallel in some sense of your work.
Marie-Helene Pelletier:
Yeah, well, so the short version of the stories, just so everyone can understand a bit of what we're talking about here, what had happened is, yes, Nick and I did a fair bit of mountaineering, various trekking in different countries and all this, and yes, on that year we had decided to go do that eight-day traverse in the Canadian Rockies, which involved crossing a river on the first day. And we did in a very successful way with lots of planning, plan A, plan B, strategizing together, and of course we were quite fresh. It was day one. Turns out, midway through that traverse, we, for all kinds of reason, could not continue made the decision to come back. We had almost no choice, really. So we came back, which meant we recrossed this river, but the river was much bigger than the first time because it was late June of a year that had received a lot of snow, so it was actually much more tumultuous, and yeah, I almost drowned in that second situation.
And then the learning after, well after, it was, okay, wait, this really functions the same way for us in our work life as it relates to resilience on the equivalent of day one, where we're at our best, fresh, high energy, we're planful, we're strong, it all works out. Bring on the challenges. And then we get to a different context, like the equivalent of day eight there where we're like, yes, very drained from eight additional days of walking. The challenge looks the same, but it's not. It's much bigger, but we treat it the same way, blah, blah, blah. Well, then it puts our resilience in the story, our life really, but our resilience at risk, and what could change that is being more realistic about the context we're in, being differently planful and protecting our resilience.
Gary Schneeberger:
We talk a lot on the show about resilience. That's one of the words we say most often, and I think it's important for listeners and viewers to hear what you're saying. You were a bit of an expert in this subject and you went on this mountaineering trip with your husband and you fell short of some of the resilience goals that you maybe thought were innate. And I think one of the things that this episode is going to do a real lot of help for people is to explore how resilience isn't just something you're born with.
It's not innate. It's not, to Warwick's point earlier, it's not a superpower that, hey, I think we think we can manifest it at all times, and the perspective you bring is so important because you have to work at that in the same way you can't manifest big muscles all the time. You got to go to the gym. It's the same sort of thing. So I just want to make sure folks understand that and hear that, that what we're going to explore now is how you build that resilience plan and that resilience muscle to move forward.
Warwick Fairfax:
Yeah, excellent point, Gary, and I love what you say, Marie-Helene, in their book that resilience is not a given. You need a strategy and it's not a one and done, it's sort of diet and exercise. Well, I went to the gym six months ago and I ate right and didn't eat any junk food and I'm good. I just do that once a year and I'm fine. No, if you don't do it regularly, there'll be a decline in your ability to perform at your optimal level. And I have a feeling that resilience is the same way. You've got to be doing things constantly to be at your maximum resilience performance level, which is counterintuitive for many people. It's like, hey, once I've gotten through five or 10 different crises, well, I have the tool. I mean, I know what I need to do, and there's some truth in that, but in life, you can get a little flabby and overconfident, and just because you accomplished some feat that required resilience doesn't mean you don't have to keep in shape, if that makes sense.
Marie-Helene Pelletier:
It does. And there is, I think, a couple of pieces to add to these analogies. So yes, in order to build a muscle, you want to, for example, go to the gym, and there will be times where there isn't a gym or you cannot go to the gym or you are in three airports over the course of 20 hours, there's not going to be a gym. Some airports do have them, yay, but most of the time, not really. So what do we do in these circumstances? Sometimes the context changes and there will be different ways to maintain your training. Maybe you're going to walk gate to gate more often even if you don't need to. So taking your context into account is important in terms of taking actions today. The other piece too is, to your other comment work, is that sometimes we'll use old data to decide where we're at now. Sometimes we'll say, oh yeah, I've gone through these, whatever, 10, 25, whatever, different things, and therefore I'm good.
Well, okay, you went through these things and they happened in a certain context. The context today is not the same. So if you are deciding that you're fine because you did these things, you were fine when you did these things, relatively, and it's old data if you try to apply this now. Different times. If we're wanting to increase our resilience even further, our ability to go through all these challenges, then we want to take into account our context. We can't just say, oh yeah, let's do all the things. That's where people get stuck. They can't. They don't.
Warwick Fairfax:
Yeah. One of the fascinating things about your model is this whole supply and demand, which obviously economists are very familiar with that, but in resilience you talk about areas that give you energy and health and then other areas that drain, and you talk about a ratio of supply to demand. So talk about that, because that seems, it makes sense, but somewhat revolutionary to talk about supply and demand in resilience.
Gary Schneeberger:
That is indeed a very fresh concept. The notion of supply and demand in resilience. Discover how Dr. Pelletier answers Warwick's question after these words from our sponsors.
Marie-Helene Pelletier:
It's just terms that, and I use the terms differently than into the ways an economist would use them here, like you said, I mean your sources of energy, what brings it up, and the places where it comes down. In itself, fairly simple. Everyone's nodding, yes, okay, here are the problems. What happens is we overestimate our sources of supply. Seriously. Every single time I ask someone, what brings you energy and what do you do that brings you energy? They will start listing, oh yeah, going for walks, sometimes on my own or with my partner, and they list all kinds of things. Then I say, great. In the past two weeks, how many times? Well, the past three months have been extremely busy, so not now, but in general. So we overestimate all of these. Then when we're looking at the demands, I say, okay, what kinds of demands are you facing?
And then they usually one to three things at work that they don't like, big demands, and that's it. And it's only when I stay longer and I say, okay, what else is going on at work and at home? Demands that, yeah, the ones you would prefer not to have, but also those that you are happy to have. It's just that they're demanding energy, a renovation at home, a new role at work, a new team member at work that you need to support a bit more. You want these things, but they still represent demands.
Point is, we underestimate these. So between overestimating the supply and underestimating the demands, again, we've got no reason to invest in our resilience because we're great. But when we become realistic about this, and that's one of the worksheets, we'll have them in the show notes if your audience is interested, but there are worksheets that are free there. You can do them with the book or without the book that just allow you to make that reflection. And many times I've heard people do that particular one that you picked as a game changer for them, because if you pair this, then with your values, for example and other aspects, then your next actions start to emerge.
Warwick Fairfax:
Yeah, it's funny, as I was reading your book, I'm somebody that's, I think very carefully before saying yes, I'm a reflective person. I don't make decisions quickly, which has its pluses and minuses. So I tend, and I'm from Australia. In Australia, it's not like North America. We actually do, no offense, value vacations and downtime. It's a cultural value.
Marie-Helene Pelletier:
Yay for that.
Warwick Fairfax:
So nobody's going to say, I'm going to take off three or four weeks and go backpacking and Southeast Asia or see the mountains in Europe. Everybody would say, great, good for you. Here, it's like, what's your problem? Going to get off the fast track? But anyway, even for me, when we go to a non-denominational church here, and there were a couple of board committees and it's like, well, I can do those. And again, I think because I'm not leading them, but it gave me pause saying, am I doing something that's somewhat unusual for me and saying yes to things I shouldn't have said yes to just because I really want to do them? And we don't need to get into the analysis here, but reading your book made me think, even if there's somebody like me that tends to be very cautious about saying yes, even for me, it's possible, if you get what I'm saying, I don't tend to jump in and say yes to thousands of things. That's not my nature.
Marie-Helene Pelletier:
Yes. Well, but it's a great point what you're saying because sometimes people think that because we're, however we define it, say, more reflective, slower at making decisions, or we're more introverted, whatever the reasons are that we're not impulsively saying yes as if that automatically protected us. No, no, no, no. Sometimes in here, in that reflection comes all kinds of beliefs that will make you say yes, this is what everyone expects of me. This is the right thing to do. Or feeling any kind of guilt in case you say no, so therefore you say yes. I mean, this could all be happening here. We're not less at risk over here. So it's a great observation because I'm sure some of our listeners today may otherwise may have thought that too.
Gary Schneeberger:
One of the things that leaps to mind work was just saying that there's some things that he likes to do, but does he have, is it possible for something to be both something that gives you satisfaction but also drains on you? I mean, can you have something that is both of these opposites in some ways that you talk about as part of the resilience model? Can something be two things at once, good and bad like that?
Marie-Helene Pelletier:
Yes. The example most of my audiences will naturally come up with is usually golf. They'll say, what do I do with this? Which column does my golfing go in? So yes, that's an example. It's a good one. And there are others, of course, yes, that will happen as well. And that's okay because when we're doing this kind of reflection, different from, say, the analysts on Wall Street, for example, where there is only one place for that number and here is the column for it. In this reflection, it's a bit more fluid. So we need to tolerate that fact that, yeah, well look at this. It goes in both columns, it's fine. And then you just continue your reflection still because we're the human side of things where, yes, at times it will be like this, but I love that you brought it up because otherwise sometimes people can get stuck with it and not feel that there's doing something wrong. No, you're not. Just carry on, keep going. We need this reflection to continue so you can get to your strategic resilience plan.
Warwick Fairfax:
I wonder, just faced with Gary's example, if you've got something that's both exciting but maybe draining, maybe you ask yourself, is this net demand or net supply, what's the net effect? It doesn't mean that you say no, but at least if it's on balance, I really like this, I feel very motivated, but it's going to be huge amount of work. And so okay, it doesn't mean you say no, but you pay attention to the consequences. Does that make sense? Is it a net demand or supply this exciting new thing that you really want to do?
Marie-Helene Pelletier:
Yes. And that's in part why in the various worksheets, then you also get to the one that looks at your context because there will be times when it's a overall net positive, and there may be other times in your life where these days it's more a net negative. So it depends on the context. And I love what you were commenting on as well, that a lot of what we're doing with this, which is actually again, very aligned with when we're being strategic in a business context. It's not like being strategic and using the tools we use to help our thinking. It's not like we haven't thought of any of these things before.
They were part of the overall, yeah, yeah, they were on our radar. But what it does is it helps us avoid blind spots. It collects the information in a way that we can actually tolerate it together and then get us a decision. It increases how deliberate we are about where we're going. That's in part being strategic. That's the idea. So same here, but that's a bit of where you were going, I think, with your observation that, well, you may still decide to do that volunteer board or that committee over here that you're not chairing, but you're part of... But instead of just doing it because it looks fine, you've paused now and said, ah, yeah, okay. How long is the term for this thing? You just thought about it a bit longer, maybe you're still going to say yes. You've just said yes now with more visibility on your overall situation.
Warwick Fairfax:
Since I'm just one person, if travel comes up or something happens and I want to say, get off the ramp, that's okay. The world won't end. It's a volunteer committee. One of the other things I love and hear is you talk about assumptions and the role, and you have a very funny example where I think you were at an airport and it said, when daddy travels, it's like, hey, I travel, what about mommy travels? And you end coming back, and it turns out it was there, but they were sold out. It was on the other side of the bookshelf. So just talk about, it's a funny story, but talk about the role of assumptions and why that's important in your model.
Marie-Helene Pelletier:
It's important in so many ways. It's important in the healthy work culture, in psychological health and safety, in good couple relationships. I mean, watching our assumptions in general is probably a good direction to consider. And so bringing this up here in this context that, again, it's in the context of realizing which, perhaps assumptions you're making, and stepping back to reflect on, okay, what is actually realistically going on? Maybe asking questions, maybe learning more information, but not just judging too fast without checking the actual situation.
And so for some individuals, it leads to their strategic resilience plan involving a pillar that is about better estimating time. A lot of the time, people, for example, will underestimate how long it takes take to do anything, which makes them a few minutes late to everywhere they go, and they're stressed out all the way there most of the time. And so sometimes they realize, okay, wait a second, I value family, yet because of my tendency to think I can do seven things in the three minutes between now and the moment we're leaving, that means I'm going to try to get them done and maybe one more just in case. And then you're stressed out driving there or you're late, which does not align with the rest of your value. So sometimes checking these assumptions that you're operating with, making them more realistic can be the next step you need to take.
Warwick Fairfax:
It's so true. And then there might be other people that maybe they're just being in one job their whole lives and they're so cautious that they underrate their own abilities and fear is a great motivator, unfortunately, and tends to immobilize you. It's like, well, I can't do that. So you've got people at either spectrum or as you say, depending on the context, you can be both ends of the spectrum depending on what's happening in your life. And so both aren't helpful is to be overly optimistic, overly pessimistic. You ought to be realistic somewhere in the middle. Now, you talked about this before, there are values and pillars that looks like they're a bit different, but talk about why values is important in the context of your strategic resilience plan, because it seems like it's pretty fundamental.
Marie-Helene Pelletier:
Fundamental, yes. And again, similarly to how our values in a business context will be fundamental. The business can potentially do many things, but they will choose to do only certain things, and that's in part connected with their values and their vision, their mission, all of that. And so similarly here, your plan right now is going to be different from your plan in six months from now and different from mine today and six months from now as well. And that's in part our context. It's also in part our values. So just like in any strategy, there's an important aspect of choosing what not to do. So same thing here. As much as we would like to do everything, not possible, so where do we put priorities? We're going to choose some elements, some parts of this situation over others, and connecting that with our values is what's going to make the plan align with who you are. We also have research showing that these choices will also lead to more happiness and better mental health of course, but that's how you make your plan customized specific to you.
Warwick Fairfax:
I mean, it makes so much sense rather than doing what you think you should do or what success looks like in a business sense, what does success in more of a eternal, lifelong, spiritual, whatever your sets of values are more than just success by one definition. I think in my own life, my kids are all adults now, but there was a time when they were younger and it was a high value of mine to be around and go to their sports games. And I have two boys and a girl, and my boys got more of my wife's jeans, it's more athletic. But I always jokingly say to my people, choose your jeans carefully, but what are you going to do? But anyway, so my boys say, dad, you are always there at our game. So we at birthdays just go around the table and say, what do you most admire about that person?
It's just something we've always done. So when it's my birthday or Father's Day, they say that a fair amount, which is obviously very gratifying, but they're out of the nest now. So context has changed. And so missing their sports game is not the current context. So if I wanted to, I could travel more or do other things. So for me, family was a very important value to me, and being around my kids' activity was very important. That's obviously my choice, but it came from my value set. And so that limited some choices, I suppose. But I was okay with that. I wasn't willing to be some management consultant, which I probably have the skills to do if I'd wanted to and be traveling every week of the year. That's not a judgment, it's just, as the example makes sense, I just wanted my life to be in line with my values.
Marie-Helene Pelletier:
That's it. That is the idea. Yes. And what's beautiful also with this is that we're seeing emerging research on, because we've heard of course the research about that importance of meaning and purpose and belonging and all this, and a concept that's emerging a bit more also is mattering. And mattering is also alignment with our own values. When we are a parent of a younger child, mattering involves in part just saying, I value you no matter what you do, kind of thing. And that even that presence at those games sends that message, right? Whether you win, you lose, I'm showing up, I'm there, you're important. That's it. So you matter in effect. But as we get older, sometimes we need to feed that sense ourselves. And part of how we feed that sense of mattering is having clarity on our values and bringing these values in our life. So in this particular context of creating a strategic resilience plan, then yes, if we align this with our values, it all connects in beautiful ways.
Warwick Fairfax:
And it's so fascinating what you're saying, Marie-Helene, is if you're working for a company whose values are out of line with yours, forget whether they're good or bad. Let's assume it depends on your perspective, whether they're good or bad, but it's out of alignment with you. It will obviously be very draining on you because every day you feel like you're having to make decisions that's completely out of line with who you are as a person. So if you are thinking about how can I be more resilient? Well, maybe be in a context where it's more in line with your values. I mean, you should want to do that anyway over and above resilience. But I feel like young people more and more want to be in context that line up with their values and they're not willing to stay somewhere that they don't enjoy. They're just, well, sorry, I'm leaving, because 30, 50 years ago it's like you were there for a life. It's different now. So you find that's a different context that we're in now.
Marie-Helene Pelletier:
It is an overall different context. Depending on some countries will have children in school talk way more about mental health than older people have received in their own education. Different countries talk about it more than others as well. But overall, because we're all more connected, everyone's hearing more about it. Now, the other piece too about yes, the tolerance for this not the right fit for me is very different than the overall mentality of say, 20, 30, 40 years ago. Yes. The other piece too, to keep in mind, as because there will also most of the time not be 100% alignment. This is a workplace, I'm one of the individuals in it and we're many individuals, so there's an element of some of that will be normal, but for each of us, yeah, where is that line where the alignment just does not seem to connect the way it should?
And there's also very far on the same continuum, you get to a point where you're into moral injury, where the difference between your own values and what needs to happen here is so significant that it creates clashes. And that is not just something that is unpleasant or challenging, it gets to your mental health. And so it's important because sometimes people think that, well, if you really want to, if whatever the pay is such that I want to stay or whatever, I can just put my head down and stay. No, there is a cost to this at some point. And so you want to, again, in considering the overall context, you want to keep this in mind too.
Warwick Fairfax:
Absolutely. It can really erode your resilience. So talk about pillars, because that was another interesting element. You've got some examples like boundaries, self-care, recovery, mindfulness. Talk about why pillars are important and why figuring out your two or three key strategic pillars is critical.
Marie-Helene Pelletier:
Well, truly, I'm using the same tools we would use in a business. We're going to launch this new product. We want it to be successful. We've looked at the context and we realized that maybe just one other companies offering this, but not many, whatever, we may choose that one of our pillars is to own the market from a marketing perspective and be very visible, for example. Another pillar, there'll be two or three pillars, usually more than five, so that we know where we're going, we know what the tactics are in the business context, that's the actions, and we're delivering. So it provides a direction, a clarity on the structure, and we're moving. Okay. And because it's all based on the current context, it's doable. It's not impossible or anything like this. So the same here works for us. If we've gone through our values and for example, realize we value family and we have, I don't know, a number of them. Let's say 10, 12, whatever.
We've gone through the exercise of supply and demand. We've gone through the context. We may realize that we actually need a pillar here that's going to be called family relationships because it's important for us. We know this, you've been at your kids' games and all, but I'm pairing your brain with mine right now for the example. But maybe a pillar is going to be family and maybe the actions will be, I'm going back to having at least one Zoom call a week with this person. I'm going back to, if I'm working from home and someone from the family comes in my office to say something, I'm not turning with my hands on the keyboard here. I'm standing up and walking outside to be fully there for them. That's an example. And we may have two or three other pillars, but they will be personal to each of us in this context.
Warwick Fairfax:
Yeah, I mean that's extremely helpful, whatever that is. It could be boundaries or yeah, it's just making sure that you design your life around the context you're in, the values you have, what you want to achieve in life. I mean, it's just really being mindful in the full sense of that word, of what it is you want. And so I guess these are all elements of having a strategic resilient plan so that you don't do something crazy. And I think as we were saying earlier, the time to think about this is before the hurricane hits. Then it's like a little late just when things are fairly calm. One of the other things I'm curious about is we talk a lot on our podcast and the work we do about what we call a team of fellow travelers, people that come alongside you because no person should be an island. So where do other people come in terms of your strategic resilience plan? People that you obviously invite in, you get to decide the who and the why that you would invite them. How does that work, other people?
Marie-Helene Pelletier:
Yes. Well, it will depend on each person's context. Let's say right now you are very surrounded. You've got your own executive coach, you've got your own peer network. You talk to Gary on a regular basis, this is there. So if you're creating a strategic plan to get your resilience to the next level, it doesn't need to be there. It's already part of your life. It's in, you're good, you're going to focus on other things. But if it's not there, it will probably become a pillar to say, oh my God, I've been focusing on, I don't know, other projects and I've let go of investing in relationships even though each of our plans will be different based on our values and all this. As I discussed in the book, the reality is we do have research that indicates the kinds of things that will, we know from research, increase our resilience. Relationships is one of them. And so if it is not part of what's around you, I would say consider in your pillars, maybe there is one of those pillars that will allow you, force you in a healthy way to bring this back.
Warwick Fairfax:
Let's say you have some successful executive who tends to be overly optimistic about how much you can put on your plate and underrate how much you need a break, a vacation, which would be normal. Having somebody come alongside you that's, let's say known you for 10, 20 years, whatever, friend, a colleague. And when you say, yep, I can handle that, that's no problem. Somebody that can say, well, we've known each other for 20 years, and you ask them, do you think I can do this? You might, but it'll be a higher cost.
And if you had two or three people that you trust and they've known you for years, they all say, Hey, Warwick, Gary, Marie-Helene. I mean, it's your choice, but I don't know. None of us really see this as a smart move in terms of your values and you are significantly overestimating how much you can do. People talk about three-sixties a lot, and a lot of people ignore the data, but my attitude is if two or three people around me who I trust or say something that could be wrong, but the data would say probably not, and they're not telling me what to do, they're just saying, you say you can do all of this. That's not the person that I think you're underestimating how much of a challenge is going to be. Does that make sense?
Marie-Helene Pelletier:
It does. It does. I think in general, we tend to just try to confirm what we already believe when someone says anything. So if it's aligned with what we're thinking, we take it. If it's not, we say, well, not valid, not listening to that. But the reality is in being more realistic about our context, and most people, most leaders and professionals, you get to a point in your career where you realize this is something to listen for. You get to a point where you're like, you know what? You may not like it, but if you listen, it's better. And I think it's in part experience is in part having not listened so many times and every single time realizing yourself later that these people were right. At some point you're like, okay, it's a blind spot. I don't tend to listen, and because I've learned it, I will listen now. And it could be a pillar, listening more to other people's opinions. So depending on where you are, maybe you're next pillar. Yes.
Warwick Fairfax:
So as we sort of begin to sum up here, there's probably some people are pretty skeptical of the whole strategic resilience plan. Sounds like an idea, but I don't really have time and I'm just resilient and all that. But when do you feel like the light bulb goes off and they go, you know what? This thing really works and it makes sense, what kind of switches them from maybe good in theory, but I don't really have time to figure out a resilience plan because I just intuitively, I'll figure it out, because a smart and capable and highly evolved, highly evolved individual.
Marie-Helene Pelletier:
I know. And you are, of course you are.
Warwick Fairfax:
Everybody thinks they're highly evolved.
Marie-Helene Pelletier:
So I would say, I mean again, we'll be responsive to some things more at times than others, and that's okay. If it's not for you right now, it's fine. I would say maybe have a look at the book chapter one because that's where I'm pulling the big guns. That's where I'm saying, you're telling yourself this. Here's why you're wrong. I'm saying it more gently, but that's sort of the essence really, so that we can get to your blind spots as fast as possible. The exercises are between five and 10 minutes each, so I know you don't have time. So if you're taking, I'm going to say a four-hour flight, you can get through this, and so it's doable, but if it's not for you right now, it's not for you right now. The reality is that it's backed up by research and that's what businesses do.
Warwick Fairfax:
Well, and to our world, we commissioned some research with a few thousand people that showed that about 72% of people had a crisis in their lives so painful that it fundamentally transformed their life. And the researchers that did this, and I'm not a social science researcher, but they are, the 28% said no. In all probability, they weren't actually being honest with themselves, just looking at the data and the underlying answers. So the point is, you might feel like I'm not going to hit a wall. I'm not going to have a crucible. I'm good. Well, in all likelihood, if you haven't had one, you probably will have one. And so you need to have a strategic resilience plan for when that unimaginable crisis happens, because it will happen. Life is not easy. It could be external, it could be family, it could be business, it could be health, it could be all sorts of things. So it's unrealistic to think life is not Disney World. I mean, bad things will happen.
Marie-Helene Pelletier:
Well, and even if it's challenges that are no bigger than any of the challenges you've had in the past six months, having a plan will just allow you to go through them in an even easier, more joyful way. Seriously.
Warwick Fairfax:
Yeah. And I'm sure as you talk to the folks that you deal with, you have a plan for investment, for sales, for costs, for acquisition. You have a plan and a strategy for everything. Why wouldn't you have a plan and a strategy for your own resilience? Because that will help you get to the next level in every area of your life. Wouldn't you want to do that? Why wouldn't you want to plan in this area? You wouldn't buy a company and say, yeah, I just have this gut instinct, but I won't do any research. I feel like it's a good idea. I mean, your board would throw you out in a nanosecond if you came in there with that recommendation. I just feel like it's good, but I've got no data to back up my opinion. I mean, so not having a strategic resilience plan makes no sense, but you've got to plan for every other area of your life, right?
Marie-Helene Pelletier:
That's right. Something to think about.
Gary Schneeberger:
I heard the sound, Warwick, I heard the sound. It was the captain turning on the fasten seatbelt sign indicating we've begun our descent to land the plane on this conversation. But you said something as the captain about, we're getting close to turning the corner here. So the captain's lined up here for this. So I will give you the opportunity to ask MH the last question here, and then we'll be on the ground.
Warwick Fairfax:
Yeah, I don't know that I have a last question other than just to thank you so much for being here, and it's just an honor to have you. I love your work and strategic resilience, and I hope people will pay more attention to what you're doing, because it would save people a lot of heartache, and there can be challenges you can't avoid, but there can be challenges you can avoid or at least minimize the consequences of. And maybe you can turn somewhat of a significant challenge into a smaller challenge with better resilience strategies.
Marie-Helene Pelletier:
That's right. And in the context where more will come, who doesn't want that, really? And yes, it can actually allow you to bring your even better self to both your professional and your personal life.
Gary Schneeberger:
And that folks, gets the plane on the ground for another episode of Beyond the Crucible, a really interesting one that hopefully you heard that resilience is not something that you're born with, it's something you can build and it can crucible proof your life in some ways, or at least make crucibles easier to get through. And that's what we're all about here. So if you enjoyed this conversation, we encourage you on whatever podcast app you're listening to, or if you're on YouTube, click subscribe to the channel that you're on and you can hear these kinds of conversations every week. And until the next time we're together, remember, you understand crucible experiences are hard, but we also know they're not the end of your story. If you learn the lessons from them and you apply them to your course moving forward, that path moving forward can lead to the most rewarding destination of your life. And that destination is a life of significance.
Welcome to a journey of transformation with the Beyond the Crucible assessment. Unlike any other, this tool is designed to guide you from adversity to achievement. As you answer a few insightful questions, you won't just find a label like the Helper or the Individualist. Instead, you'll uncover your unique position in the journey of resilience. This assessment reveals where you stand today, the direction you should aim for, and crucially the steps to get there. It's more than an assessment. It's a roadmap to a life of significance. Ready? Visit BeyondtheCrucible.com. Take the free assessment and start charting your course to a life of significance today.
This week, in the latest episode of our series within the show Stories from the Book Crucible Leadership, we look at the courage, good humor and determination– both personal and political – that made Franklin Delano Roosevelt one of history’s most celebrated figures.
None of what he accomplished in the White House, we discuss here, would have been possible if Roosevelt didn’t have two critical things necessary to move beyond a crucible: a mindset shift that he wouldn’t let his polio prevent him from living an active life; and fellow travelers who helped him keep going so that he could indeed, move from private trial to public triumph.
“A smooth sea never made a skilled sailor,” Roosevelt once said — and his life is a ringing testament to that truth we’d all be wise to remember.
To explore Beyond the Crucible resources, including our free Trials-to-Triumphs Self-Assessment, visit beyondthecrucible.com
Enjoy the show? Leave a review on your favorite podcast app and be sure to tell your friends and family about us.
Warwick Fairfax:
Welcome to Beyond the Crucible. I'm Warwick Fairfax, the founder of Beyond the Crucible. I've often thought that polio made Roosevelt the man that he was. Without polio, he would've been a different person. Would he have been as successful? It's really hard to see it. Would he have had the legacy that he had? Really hard to see how that would've been possible. So I mean, there's no question Franklin Roosevelt was not defined by his worst day in 1921 when he got polio. He had every right to say, "Look, it is been fun while it lasted. I'll have enough money to have a nice life. I love summers here in Campobello Island in Canada. I have a nice life and the estate in Hyde Park in New York, and I have a wonderful wife, nice family. I'll read and maybe see the odd friend in private and write a bit, but I'll have a nice quiet life on my estate." But he didn't choose that path.
Gary Schneeberger:
No, no, he did not. The man who would become America's 32nd president chose a bold path, a risky path, a path that led him to lead one of our nation's most resounding public lives of significance. I am Gary Schneeberger, co-host of the show. This week, in the latest episode of our series within the show, Stories from the Book Crucible Leadership, we look at the courage, good humor and ambition, both personal and political that made Franklin Delano Roosevelt, one of history's most celebrated figures.
None of what he accomplished in the White House we discuss here would've been possible if Roosevelt didn't have two critical things necessary to move beyond a crucible, a mindset shift that he wouldn't let his polio prevent him from living an active life, and fellow travelers who helped him keep the faith that he could indeed move from private trial to public triumph. "The smooth sea never made a skilled sailor," Roosevelt once said, and his life is a ringing testament to that truth we'd all be wise to remember. Just real quickly, to set you up like we do every month when we talk about this, is that Warwick's book, I still can't believe this is true, Warwick, when I say it was released in 2022, it seems like it was released yesterday, doesn't it?
Warwick Fairfax:
Indeed.
Gary Schneeberger:
But it was released in 2022. And it's an important book because it's the book that birthed the business. There would be no Beyond the Crucible if there was not a crucible leadership. And each month, we are going through, we have gone through one of the historical family figures, leaders that Warwick has talked about at some length in the book that Warwick discusses at some length because there are lessons we can learn about bouncing back from our crucibles from the way that they bounced back from theirs. And this month, we are going to look at Franklin Delano Roosevelt, the longest-serving US president in history, and specifically what Roosevelt can teach us about overcoming adversity, especially adversity that's tied to a disability. And truly, the lessons that we can learn here, folks, from his life of overcoming physically and emotionally devastating crucibles are things that we can really, truly apply to our own crucibles.
We don't have to have the same crucibles as Roosevelt had to learn lessons from the way he dealt with them. So that's the setup here, Warwick. I know you're dying to dig in, so I'll ask you the first question. And it's pretty open-ended, and that's this why Franklin Roosevelt? There's no shortage of great leaders in your book and in general who have endured traumatic crucibles, but Roosevelt story is a bit of a masterclass in not letting your worst day, your toughest circumstances define you, isn't it? Isn't his story kind of really a shining example of what that looks like?
Warwick Fairfax:
Yeah, Gary, it surely is. As listeners know by now, I grew up in Australia with a dad that loved history, and he loved English history, British heroes. So I grew up with hearing about Churchill and Admiral Horatio Nelson that we covered in the recent podcast of Battle of Trafalgar Fame in the late 1700s, early 1800s, as well as the Duke of Wellington and Battle of Waterloo Fame in 1815. So I grew up with all of these English heroes, but I actually had a love of American history. I had a teacher in high school, Mr. Patrojan. He just had this passion for American history and would make it come alive. And so probably partly through that, I just loved some of the great American leaders such as Lincoln and Washington. But there was something about Franklin Roosevelt that I felt, in some strange way, a special connection to.
That's because Franklin Roosevelt, perhaps as much as any president in US history, he came from a very patrician, almost aristocratic background, and he was able to achieve something great despite his heritage. He was able to, I don't say overcome it, but his legacy, we think of is not because of his heritage, because of the greatness of the man, the greatness of his character in the sense of how he led the nation. And so as somebody, as listeners would know, that grew up in this 150-year-old family business in Australia that was very prominent, was wealthy, there was in some sense, I could identify with a young Franklin Roosevelt growing up with this incredible legacy. And yet he wasn't defined by the legacy of his heritage. And so in that way, as we see Franklin Roosevelt overcoming his challenges, as I was growing up in Australia as a boy in school, there was something in me that thought, obviously being president, leader of the country is probably not going to happen, but maybe there's something about his character, something about how he approached challenges that I could learn from.
So there was something about Franklin Roosevelt that I felt this connection to. We all, as kids growing up, want to identify with people like us. And in a sense it's like, well, this is kind of like me. He grew up in a prominent family. So did I. so Franklin Roosevelt, he was born in 1882 in Hyde Park, New York. And just to show you how patrician his family was, between his mother's family, the Delanos, and his father's, the Roosevelts, he had no fewer than 12 Mayflower ancestors. That's the Mayflower that went to Massachusetts in the 1600s. And people talk about descendants of the Mayflower as if it's the oldest, most prominent families, that kind of legacy in the US. And he attended the elite prep school, Groton, in Massachusetts, and then went to Harvard University. So he had this educational pedigree, he had this pedigree by birth. He was from a prominent family.
And interestingly enough, it was during his Harvard years that he met Theodore Roosevelt's niece, Eleanor Roosevelt. So Eleanor who in this sense, her maiden name and married name were the same, she was Roosevelt before marriage, Roosevelt after. So she was a distant cousin of his. And as people may remember, Theodore Roosevelt was president of the US in the early 1900s. So quite a dynamic figure in history. So he has this connection to the Roosevelt family and obviously to Theodore Roosevelt. So Roosevelt's career started in 1910 when he became a New York State Senator. Then he became assistant secretary of the Navy in 1913 under President Woodrow Wilson. And then in 1920, he was the vice presidential candidate under the Democratic presidential nominee, James Cox. Now, Cox lost that election, but it would seem like in 1920, Roosevelt's star was on the rise. He had been a New York state senator, Undersecretary of the Navy, now vice presidential candidate. It seems like there was no limit. The sky was the limit on Roosevelt's political career.
Gary Schneeberger:
And it's a good point to stop at this point because I know what's coming next, and that is if you looked at Franklin Roosevelt's life up to this point, not a whole lot of crucibles were bumping into him, right? I mean, he had, I don't want to say an easy life, but he had perhaps an easy going in some ways life. I mean, he did not grow up hardscrabble. So what was to come when crucibles come couldn't have been something he was accustomed to.
Warwick Fairfax:
Yeah, it's such a good point, Gary, because we know who Franklin Roosevelt is now in history. But a pre-1921 Roosevelt, yes, there was this patrician wealthy family, but he had this charisma, this easy going manner, this almost magnetic personality. He was the perfect kind of person you want at a party. "Oh, Franklin's going to be here, it's going to be a wild time. It's going to be a great time." So there's fun, loving, charismatic, affluent, aristocratic American. You're not thinking of him in that way because he became such a different person in a lot of ways. But that was who he was at the time. So in 1921, at the age of 39, Roosevelt was on his way to his family vacation home in Campobello Island, New Brunswick in Canada. It's just across the border from Maine. And on his way up there, Roosevelt visited a boy scout camp, and while he was there, he contracted polio.
Now, when you think of polio, it tends to be more contracted by kids. Back then in the '20s, '30s, and probably maybe even through the '40s or beyond, polio was just this real scourge, especially in summer. And people were contracted around other kids and swimming pools, and for parents, it was just an incredibly scary thing. And so here's Roosevelt that contracts at age 39 as an adult. So after he visits this boy scout camp, he goes to Campobello, and while he is there, he was swimming in the cold waters. And then he hiked for a couple miles afterwards on his way home. And then that evening, Roosevelt retired early and he felt tired and chilled. By the next day, one leg was paralyzed. The following day, both legs were paralyzed.
So it's hard to really think of what life was like in 1921 in the US, but back then, having polio was considered almost this death sentence. It was almost considered shameful. You were meant to hide at home and be an invalid and just not go outside and certainly not be in public life. That was culturally the world that he lived in. And so Roosevelt's mother indeed urged him to retire to the family estate in Hyde Park, New York, which is a few hours north of New York City. Fortunately, his wife, Eleanor Roosevelt had a different perspective because Eleanor knew that if Franklin gave up his active lifestyle and his interest in politics, his soul would die. His body was crippled and his soul was obviously hurting because his whole sense of self was wrapped up in his political career. And another important influence, as we'll see in a bit, was his longtime advisor, Louis Howe. And so Roosevelt made a choice, as we'll get into later, in terms of how he approached his physical crucible, and he indeed did get back into political life.
Gary Schneeberger:
Let me stop you there for a second, Warwick, sorry, because again, I found this great quote from him that lines up perfectly with what you're talking about, right? Because his mother urges him, "Just go retire and basically be taken care of. The family's got a lot of money." Here's something that Roosevelt said that I think just speaks to his situation, but also speaks to Beyond the Crucible so well, he said this, "Happiness is not the mere possession of money. It lies in the joy of achievement in the thrill of creative effort." That right there explains why he kept going on, that he didn't listen to his mother, that he did heed the counsel of Eleanor and Louis Howe, and he just followed his own heart. And to not being just rich, he wanted to have a rich life where he was able to give back, he was able to do things that changed the world he lived in. And that was, I think, a great... I mean, clearly that motivation was there for him in 1921 when the polio hit.
Warwick Fairfax:
Yeah, it's an interesting question. It's probably unknowable, but would a pre-1921 Franklin Roosevelt say, "Well, happiness consists more in more than money and in the pursuit of creative endeavors and achievement," maybe, it's hard to know, but the depth of the truth of that statement became far truer, I think, far more ingrained in his soul after that. It's one thing to say, "Yeah, abstractly, sure, there's more to life than money. It's contribution, it's achievement." But that was surely the case because life was not easy after 1921. So that's a great, great quote. And it's interesting to hear him say that this happiness doesn't really consist in having money. Very true, which we talk a lot about on this podcast. And so well said, Franklin Roosevelt.
In 1928, Roosevelt was out to speak at the Democratic National Convention in Houston to nominate Alfred Smith as the party's nominee for president. So picture this, there's 15,000 people in the audience waiting for Roosevelt, and Roosevelt has to make a long walk to the podium. Now he's got his heavy braces on, and he is leaning on his son, Elliott's arm. And people must've been watching gasping, hoping that he wouldn't trip or fall, feeling for him. And Roosevelt refused to use crutches because he felt like it would be a huge political handicap. It would look bad. It would make him look like an invalid. Again, back then, if you were an invalid, you were meant to just stay home and retire from public or business life. That was the culture. Hard to comprehend, but it's the way it was. So Roosevelt was a smart man. He knew crutches would not be a good look. And it's interesting, in future events where he would be just sort of lumbering along these crutches, you'd have one of his two sons, Elliott or his brother helping him.
And so I read elsewhere, they had to be in incredible shape because their dad was somewhat heavily built and they had to make it look effortless as their dad was putting a lot of his weight on one of their arms, and they had to make it look like it's no big deal, and don't show any strain. I'm sure that Roosevelt gave a great nominating speech. Alfred Smith ended up losing to Herbert Hoover who became the Republican president in 1928 and was president when the Great Depression hit, which is a terrible time to be president, when you're president when the Great Depression hits. But anyway, so Alfred Smith didn't make it as president. Later that year, in 1928, Roosevelt became governor of New York, and in 1932, in the midst of the Great Depression, Roosevelt became president.
So in his inaugural address in March 1933, Roosevelt uttered these now famous words, these now immortal words, "This great nation will endure as it has endured, will revive and will prosper. So first of all, let me assert my firm belief that the only thing we have to fear is fear itself. Nameless unreasoning, unjustified terror, which paralyzes needed efforts to convert retreat into advance." So what's interesting about this is imagine a Roosevelt before polio. I don't think he would be talking about all we have to fear is fear itself. He might've said that and people might've thought, "Yeah, right. I mean, what have you ever had to fear?" He even used the words, "Paralyze needed efforts." One wonders if that was deliberate or not.
So during his presidency, Roosevelt had a huge array of accomplishments. He created the Social Security Act to provide a safety net for all Americans, providing unemployment, disability insurance, and old age pensions. He created the works progress administration to provide the unemployed with useful works to maintain their skills and bolster their self-respect. And Roosevelt, as we know, led the US in World War II after the Japanese Imperial forces attacked Pearl Harbor in December 1941. And then he, along with Winston Churchill, helped defeat Nazi Germany and Imperial Japan. So it's hard to imagine history, US history or world history without Franklin Roosevelt helping to get the US out of the Great Depression, and then helping to lead the allies in defeating Nazi Germany and Imperial Japan in World War II. So an incredible legacy that he leaves us with.
Gary Schneeberger:
And we talk a lot, Warwick, at Beyond the Crucible about the importance of mindset shift, and Roosevelt's ability to shift his mindset after polio is, as you have said of others, Olympic level, I think. I mean, yes, all those things that you listed, the WPA and social security, and pensions, incredible astoundingly important contributions, but the biggest victory of his life was shifting his mindset after polio and pressing in even harder into his pursuit of a life of significance in his work in government. So talk a little bit about just his mindset shift and why that was so powerful and so impactful in his life and in the life of this country.
Warwick Fairfax:
Absolutely, Gary. I think a reason that he is so revered and beloved is not just what he accomplished, but just his character and how he just would not give up. I mean, there is sort of the physical demonstration of that in which every day, with these heavy braces, he would walk to the end of the driveway. His whole life, he dreamed of one day being able to walk again, I mean properly walk without these hugely heavy and uncomfortable braces. He was not one to give up.
In 1921, as we've talked about, in the culture, when you got polio, you basically gave up, you retired to your home, you were looked after your family, and that's indeed what his mother, Franklin Roosevelt's mother, Sara, advocated, but Roosevelt was not willing to give up. Yes, he had his wife, Eleanor, and Louis Howe, which we'll talk about more in a moment, but it was still Roosevelt's choice, and he was not willing to give up. He was not willing to give up his political career. He was not willing to give up contributing to the society of the US and advocating for principles that he believed in.
Gary Schneeberger:
As you said, he also wasn't ready, as we say all the time... He wasn't willing to be defined by his worst day. And this is the part of shows like this that I love the most, Warwick, because I find quotes, and I hope since you love Franklin Roosevelt so much, or whomever we're talking about, I hope this is a quote. I'm always like, "Oh, maybe Warwick's never heard this one before, and I'll spring some new knowledge on him." But this is a perfect time to drop this second quote that I picked up as we're talking about his refusal to be defined by his worst day.
Roosevelt said this, it's only 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8 words. But this is what he said, "A smooth sea never made a skilled sailor." I mean that, if this mic wasn't so expensive, I'd drop it, because that's a mic drop moment. That's a mic drop moment in talking about crucibles, about Roosevelt's crucible and bouncing back from his crucible, and anybody who's had a crucible experience. "A smooth sea never made a skilled sailor," is just a beautiful expression of the importance of resilience. Check out what Warwick has to say about Roosevelt's quote and find out whether or not I did indeed surprise him after these words from our sponsors.
Warwick Fairfax:
That is a great quote. I don't believe I've heard that, so-
Gary Schneeberger:
All right.
Warwick Fairfax:
But it's true. The smooth sea of Franklin Roosevelt's life would not have made a president that people wanted to have in the White House during the 1932 election. Is this the person you would want to be leading your country, and in one sense, co-leading the world along with Winston Churchill in World War II? What does he know about hardship? What does he know about overcoming challenging circumstances? So yeah, I've often thought that polio made Roosevelt the man that he was. Without polio, he would've been a different person. Would he have been as successful? It's really hard to see it. Would he have had the legacy that he had? Really hard to see how that would've been possible. So you're right. I mean, there's no question Franklin Roosevelt was not defined by his worst day in 1921 when he got polio.
He had every right to say, "Look, it is been fun while it lasted. I'll have enough money to have a nice life. I love summers here in Campobello Island in Canada. I have a nice life and the estate in Hyde Park in New York, and I have a wonderful wife, nice family. I'll read and maybe see the odd friend in private and write a bit, but I'll have a nice quiet life on my estate." But he didn't choose that path, and he chose the path to come back. Yeah, I mean, it's just amazing how there was something about Franklin Roosevelt that gave people hope. When he talked about this, "Nothing to fear but fear itself," people could look at Roosevelt and say, "Well, you Franklin Roosevelt personify that. You are not willing to let fear of polio, fear of being an invalid define you." I mean, you think about his campaign song in 1932 at the height of the Great Depression, his campaign song was Happy Days Are Here Again.
Now, if he was some wealthy aristocratic guy playing that campaign song, he would've been mocked and ridiculed by people, by media. It would've been, "Oh, happy days are here again? Yeah, it's all right for you and your beautiful estate in Hyde Park, New York. Yeah, probably the Great Depression hasn't hit you. You're doing fine. Some of us are actually having trouble getting things to eat. We're out of a job. Happy days are here again? All right. I'm not seeing it. The bread lines, tell me where there's a happy day, none. There's poverty, misery, and homelessness." But there was something about his enthusiasm, his charisma, and how he was able to overcome his hardships that people thought, "You know what? If Franklin Roosevelt says, 'Happy Days are here again,' he's got plans, there's all these things he's going to do, I actually believe that happy days will be here again." It's just staggering.
The other thing I think about polio, it's interesting, we've had so many guests on this podcast say that what they went through was a gift. And I don't know that I've ever heard Franklin Roosevelt describe that, but in terms of the gift he was to the nation of the US and indeed the world, I feel like polio gave him a sense of empathy, a sense of compassion that enabled him to relate to others that maybe he wouldn't have been able to without that. He would go regularly to, I think it's Warm Springs in Georgia, I believe, where there was supposed to be healing waters, and I don't know if it really helped, but he would go there often. There would be other kids, other young people who had polio, and I feel like they would see Franklin Roosevelt, the US president, and this is somebody they could identify with.
"He has polio like me. Look how hard he's trying." Now, would some young polio victim in Warm Springs, Georgia being able to identify with Franklin Roosevelt without that? I doubt it. I felt like it changed him. It gave him this compassion, this drive, this empathy that I'm not sure that he had before. So I think in a real sense, polio made Franklin Roosevelt the great man that he was. I don't know that he thought of it as a gift, but it was in the way it transformed his soul, I think it was a gift to history, the rest of us in the US and to the world.
Gary Schneeberger:
It's interesting, your comments about his experience at that rehabilitation place where the kids were there and the kids kind of looked at him and were like, "Wow, if the president who has polio can do this, I, with my situation, can do this as well." It strikes me that there's a point here we all should grab onto, and that is as we're walking through our own crucibles, when we get to a certain place, when we've learned some lessons from it, as Roosevelt had by this time, it's important, isn't it? To live that a little publicly so people can see how we're overcoming that. I mean, you do that with Beyond the Crucible, right? I've seen what people have said to you, I've been in the rooms when they've said it to you. Your ability to speak authentically and honestly about your crucible has helped them with their own crucibles. That seems to be a part of what Roosevelt brought in living publicly his life beyond polio.
Warwick Fairfax:
Yeah, it's a good point. There were certainly times such as when he's in Warm Springs, Georgia, this rehabilitation center, where it was clear that he had polio and was just wrestling with it, trying to get as much range of movement. This was a different time. So he didn't want to seem like he was an invalid, so hence the braces, and he would never let himself be photographed in a wheelchair, because, "Oh, here's the weak Franklin Roosevelt." So there was a sense where he felt the public pressure to not be seen as an invalid, and the press, and this is a different era, they went right along with that.
It's hard to believe the press kept the secret, not the secret, but they kind of minimized what he went through to a degree, because they knew why he was doing this, and they respected him so much. But that being said, it was clear to the public that he had had polio, and it definitely had an effect. So yeah, he wasn't all out, "Hey, oh, woe is me. I'm going to be wheeled around the wheelchair," because there was a balance between dealing with it, but not wanting to do anything that hurt his political career. Because he was a very savvy politician. But yeah, I don't know about the severity of it. People knew that he was wrestling with polio and was remarkable what he was able to accomplish and how he seemed like a very vigorous man despite what he went through.
Gary Schneeberger:
Right, and I mean, you hit it on the head when you said his campaign song, Happy Days are Here Again. I mean, that says a lot about someone running for president who the public knew something was going on there even if they didn't know the severity as you said. So that does indeed, I think, and we've made the point several times in this conversation, helps people with their own trials and setbacks and failures. I think that's important for all of us to remember.
Warwick Fairfax:
I think it's a great point, Gary, whether we think of it like this or not, I don't know if Franklin Roosevelt thought of himself as a role model. He was focused on his political career as well as helping the nation. But I have to believe that whether it was intentional or not, he was, he gave people hope, certainly physically, but also he gave people hope that things will get better, that there is hope. Hope can indeed be a self-fulfilling prophecy as indeed doom and gloom can be a self-fulfilling prophecy in terms of your soul.
And so he really was a role model of how to deal with physical challenges, how to deal with personal challenges, and it lifted a nation. His sunny disposition, I mean, I can't think of any time you see a photograph of Roosevelt other than a big broad smile. Maybe he got depressed in his quiet moments. I'm sure he was human, but you never saw publicly him being down. He always had this sort of optimistic, we'll get through this. There'll be another day, the sun will come up. So that disposition was incredibly impactful to other people and indeed the nation.
Gary Schneeberger:
And that, his perspective, his ability to live, that was all because of this mindset shift that we talked about. And you, in your book, make special note of his advisor, Louis Howe's role in helping sort of cement that mindset shift, keep that mindset shift on track for Roosevelt. He, in fact, you make the case... A phrase we use a lot at Beyond the Crucible fellow traveler that Louis Howe was Roosevelt's chief fellow traveler, as he navigated his way back from his crucible and navigated his way through some of the most tumultuous times in American history. Why was Howe so valuable to Roosevelt making his vision a reality?
Warwick Fairfax:
Yeah, I mean, Louis Howe was hugely influential in Franklin Roosevelt's life and his path back from polio. Louis Howe met Roosevelt in 1911 when Roosevelt was a member of the New York State Senate, and Howe saw something in Roosevelt. Howe was somebody who was in political circles, and he saw a young Roosevelt as somebody that had the potential to become President. Roosevelt had this natural enthusiasm, this natural charisma that just drew people in. Even back then, there was something special about Franklin Roosevelt. So ever since that time in 1911, Louis Howe was Franklin Roosevelt's key advisor. So when Roosevelt got polio in 1921, Louis Howe was probably the chief person responsible for helping Roosevelt come back. Roosevelt's wife, Eleanor, she wasn't in the same camp as Roosevelt's mother, Sara. She knew that it would be this almost the death of his soul if he just sat there and felt bad for himself and was just an invalid in private life.
So she instinctively knew that, but Howe really helped put that idea into action. And so Louis Howe encouraged Roosevelt to keep his name in the public eye by having him issue statements on public issues that he cared about. He encouraged Roosevelt to write magazine articles, and he also encouraged him to appear at the 1924 Democratic Convention. Now, importantly, Louis Howe also urged Eleanor Roosevelt to speak across New York state to ensure that her husband remained in the public eye. Now we have to remember Eleanor Roosevelt that we remember during Roosevelt's presidency in World War II and afterwards, speaking at the United Nations, this was a different Eleanor Roosevelt in 1921. She was shy, she was retiring, she was self-conscious. The last thing Eleanor Roosevelt wanted to do was speak. She wouldn't have thought of herself as a good speaker. I'm sure she got training and encouragement from Louis Howe, and she indeed did overcome her natural shyness and fear of being in a public spotlight and spoke all around New York state because she knew this was part of Louis Howe's plan, to not let Franklin Roosevelt's name be forgotten.
She dearly loved her husband. She believed in who he was as a man and as a potential politician and just his future. So that was huge. And indeed, in the '20s, his name kept coming up. He would issue statements. Eleanor Roosevelt would speak. We mentioned before about Franklin Roosevelt speaking at the 1928 Democratic Convention where they nominated Alfred Smith, becoming New York State Governor in 1928, and then president in 1932. This was all due to Louis Howe as well as Eleanor Roosevelt. So when Franklin Roosevelt became president in 1932, and up until Howe's death in 1936, Howe was effectively his White House chief of staff. All of the things we've been talking about, the Social Security Act, the work progress administration, everything that was around in the '30s before he died, Louis Howe had a huge hand in making those things happen, and he was considered, Louis Howe, as the man who put Franklin D. Roosevelt in the White House.
And Roosevelt's son, Elliott, said this in Louis Howe. He said that, "Louis Howe was probably the greatest influence on both my father and my mother's lives." That's huge praise. When Howe died, Roosevelt had the flags put at half-mast. This wasn't some leader of the U.S. This was somebody that was his advisor, his chief of staff. That's, I'm sure, pretty unusual to have an advisor die and the flags we put at half-mast. So yeah, I mean, it's just amazing the impact that Louis Howe had on Roosevelt's life and indeed Eleanor Roosevelt's life. Without Louis Howe, would Roosevelt have been able to come back from polio? Would he have become governor of New York and President of the United States? It's really hard to know. I mean, what he was going through was really tough. I think what it shows is in our darkest moments, irrespective of our resilience and metal mindset, having somebody like Louis Howe, and then Roosevelt's wife, Eleanor, is huge in helping to build up our metal of fortitude to cope with what was an incredibly difficult situation for him personally.
Gary Schneeberger:
Yeah, and from the perspective of Beyond the Crucible, I think this story highlights two of the biggest things that we all need to bounce back from a crucible. That is, one, a mindset shift. This didn't happen to me, it happened for me, and two, fellow travelers, people who will push you to persevere, because just learning the lessons of your crucible doesn't make the journey ahead of you stone free as you're walking the path, there's still stumbling blocks. There are still things that happen. So having a fellow traveler there who can lift you up, help you move forward, encourage you, share the journey with you is pivotal. So I think this story, what we've talked about here about Franklin Delano Roosevelt is a master class in what Beyond the Crucible is all about, right?
Warwick Fairfax:
Yeah, it's such a good point, Gary. I mean, as you well say, we need two things. We need the mindset shift, and we need fellow travelers. Fellow travelers can't help you unless you're willing to make the tough decision, "I will not be defined by my worst day. I'm going to shift my mindset. My body may be paralyzed, but I'm not going to let this defeat me." You have to have that mindset shift. But having had that mindset shift, we need all the help we can get because there will be days in which we think, "Why bother?"
There've got to been days when he is making that walk down the driveway, people have written him off, and he is thinking, "Gosh, what's the point of writing that next magazine article? Is there really any point Eleanor going all across New York State speaking?" And Louis Howe probably said, "Franklin," probably would've said, "Mr. Roosevelt." I don't know if he called him Franklin or not, but just, "I believe in you. Eleanor believes in you. Your message is too important. The nation needs you. There will come a time when you'll have an opportunity in politics again. Just keep at it. Trust the process, trust yourself."
So I'm sure there were days when he needed that. There were probably days in the White House when things were not going easy, when maybe it was tough to get legislation through. And I'm sure there were days when Louis Howe said, "Mr. president, we'll find a way. We'll get this done. We have to get this done. The people need help. We'll find a way. We'll talk to the right senators and people in Congress and the House, but we'll figure out a way to get this legislation through." So I'm sure there were days in which he needed Louis Howe.
So just both of those things. We all need a mindset shift, the people who are going to be with us in the trenches when things are our darkest or things are at their darkest and can say, "You know what? We'll figure this out. We'll get through this. We can do this. You can do this. We'll do this." You need both a mindset shift and somebody in your camp like a Louis Howe. I mean, it's hard to think of fellow travelers as great as Louis Howe. He's got to be one of the greatest fellow travelers in history. I'm sure that Franklin Roosevelt would've said that.
Gary Schneeberger:
Fellow traveler hall of fame right there.
Warwick Fairfax:
Exactly.
Gary Schneeberger:
We could call it the Louis Howe Fellow Traveler Hall of Fame.
Warwick Fairfax:
Well said.
Gary Schneeberger:
Copyright, Beyond the Crucible. So we've been up here at the 30,000-foot level talking about how our listeners and viewers can apply some of these lessons. But as we wrap up, Warwick, what are some of the big takeaways that you would want our listeners and viewers to take with them from the story of Franklin Delano Roosevelt?
Warwick Fairfax:
It's a great question. If ever there was a prominent leader in history who exemplifies not letting your worst day define you, it's Franklin Roosevelt. And it's interesting contrasting Roosevelt with some other leaders. He went through very challenging circumstances, very challenging crucibles. We've got Abraham Lincoln who was president during the US Civil War when the Southern states seceded. We've got George Washington leading the American colonies military forces during the American Revolution. They went through very challenging circumstances. But what's different about Franklin Roosevelt is his crucible was not external. It was not outside forces acting upon them or their nation, as is true of Lincoln and Washington.
In Franklin Roosevelt's case, his crucible was personal. He had to dig down deep within his soul and make sure that his paralysis was only physical and that his paralysis did not define who he was as a person. In that sense, he couldn't avoid having his body be paralyzed, but he could make a decision, would his soul be paralyzed? Well, he decided, "No, I'm not going to let this paralysis affect my soul." And that was a huge decision, and that mindset shift, not to be defined by his worst day, not to be defined by his paralysis, which back then, you were indeed, in society's eyes, defined by paralysis. If you were paralyzed through polio, that defined you, that defined the rest of your life and you were meant to be this invalid that stayed at home.
So in that sense, at the time, if you got polio, it was your worst day, and it did define you. That was the attitude of society. But Roosevelt was not willing to let that define him. So when you think about Roosevelt, he was such a gift to the nation and to the world, both during the Great Depression and in World War II. His sunny disposition and optimistic attitude was exactly what the US needed in the Depression and what the world needed in World War II. We've talked a bit about the Great Depression. The way he masterfully led the US in the lead-up to World War II is something we can't forget because he was a master politician. He knew that in the US in the 1930s, there was this tremendous sense of isolationism. It's like, "Look, what's happening in Europe with Hitler, it's not a problem. We're the US let's just not worry about." And he knew that.
Roosevelt knew that at some point, war was going to come and the US couldn't avoid it, but he wanted to do everything possible to help Britain survive that was leading the allies before the US got into the war in December 1941. So he came up with these innovative ideas like the Lend-Lease Program, which basically loaned armaments and ships to Britain basically for free. It was a long-term loan. And he used this... Probably this goes down in the public relations hall of fame, this particular comment, he said, "If a neighbor comes by and wants a garden hose, aren't you going to lend it to them?" And your average person said, "Well, yeah." Well, ships and armaments worth, I don't know, millions of dollars or hundreds, whatever it was, a little bit different than a garden hose.
But somehow, that metaphor of the garden hose, people said, "Well, of course I'd lend my neighbor garden hose. Let's lend Britain all these armaments," and they said, "Of long-term leases probably interest-free." And that was brilliant politically, and it got through. That kept Britain in the war and funded with armaments. Without that, by the time of December 1941, who knows? Maybe there wouldn't have been a Britain, which would've made coming back from that infinitely harder for the US and maybe would've meant a lot more US service men and women would've lost their lives if there was no Britain. Who knows?
So Roosevelt, not only did he not let his worst day define him, he just had this brilliant, creative mindset, and he knew how to get the job done. His political savvy and public relations savvy was just off the charts. So he knew what had to be done, but just as importantly, he knew how to get the job done. He was remarkable in so many ways. But all of these gifts that he gave to the US and the world in the Great Depression and in World War II, none of them would've happened without his decision in 1921, aided by his wife, Eleanor, and Louis Howe, not to be defined by his worst day to not give up. Yes, he was paralyzed physically, but he made a decision that he was not going to be paralyzed in his soul, and he made a determination that he would come back, he would not give up and not give up his hope and dream of being active in life and in political life.
Gary Schneeberger:
Did you hear that folks? That sounded like the plane landing. I believe our host, Warwick Fairfax, just landed the plane on this very, very, very enlightening conversation on what Franklin Delano Roosevelt can teach us about moving forward beyond crucibles, especially physical crucibles as happened in his life. And that folks, with the plane on the ground, will wrap our latest episode of the show within the show that we call Stories from the Book Crucible Leadership.
This is an exciting time because the next one of these we do... In a few weeks, the next one we do will be the final one of this year. But it's going to be... And I'm not even going to try to tease you, I'm just going to tell you, because I want to see our host smile and laugh like he's doing right now. It's going to be on his father, Sir Warwick Fairfax. So I'm really looking forward to that conversation. But until that happens, we will turn the page and wait until next month for another story on Warwick's dad to help you turn the page and move beyond your crucible to a life of significance. See you then.
Welcome to a journey of transformation with Beyond the Crucible Assessment. Unlike any other, this tool is designed to guide you from adversity to achievement. As you answer a few insightful questions, you won't just find a label like the helper or the individualist, instead, you'll uncover your unique position in the journey of resilience. This assessment reveals where you stand today, the direction you should aim for, and crucially the steps to get there. It's more than an assessment. It's a roadmap to a life of significance. Ready? Visit beyondthecrucible.com. Take the free assessment and start charting your course to a life of significance today.
